

Currently released so far... 12478 / 251,287
Browse latest releases
2010/12/01
2010/12/02
2010/12/03
2010/12/04
2010/12/05
2010/12/06
2010/12/07
2010/12/08
2010/12/09
2010/12/10
2010/12/11
2010/12/12
2010/12/13
2010/12/14
2010/12/15
2010/12/16
2010/12/17
2010/12/18
2010/12/19
2010/12/20
2010/12/21
2010/12/22
2010/12/23
2010/12/24
2010/12/25
2010/12/26
2010/12/27
2010/12/28
2010/12/29
2010/12/30
2011/01/01
2011/01/02
2011/01/04
2011/01/05
2011/01/07
2011/01/09
2011/01/10
2011/01/11
2011/01/12
2011/01/13
2011/01/14
2011/01/15
2011/01/16
2011/01/17
2011/01/18
2011/01/19
2011/01/20
2011/01/21
2011/01/22
2011/01/23
2011/01/24
2011/01/25
2011/01/26
2011/01/27
2011/01/28
2011/01/29
2011/01/30
2011/01/31
2011/02/01
2011/02/02
2011/02/03
2011/02/04
2011/02/05
2011/02/06
2011/02/07
2011/02/08
2011/02/09
2011/02/10
2011/02/11
2011/02/12
2011/02/13
2011/02/14
2011/02/15
2011/02/16
2011/02/17
2011/02/18
2011/02/19
2011/02/20
2011/02/21
2011/02/22
2011/02/23
2011/02/24
2011/02/25
2011/02/26
2011/02/27
2011/02/28
2011/03/01
2011/03/02
2011/03/03
2011/03/04
2011/03/05
2011/03/06
2011/03/07
2011/03/08
2011/03/09
2011/03/10
2011/03/11
2011/03/13
2011/03/14
2011/03/15
2011/03/16
2011/03/17
2011/03/18
2011/03/19
2011/03/20
2011/03/21
2011/03/22
2011/03/23
2011/03/24
2011/03/25
2011/03/26
2011/03/27
2011/03/28
2011/03/29
2011/03/30
2011/03/31
2011/04/01
2011/04/02
2011/04/03
2011/04/04
2011/04/05
2011/04/06
2011/04/07
2011/04/08
2011/04/09
2011/04/10
2011/04/11
2011/04/12
2011/04/13
2011/04/14
2011/04/15
2011/04/16
2011/04/17
2011/04/18
2011/04/19
2011/04/20
2011/04/21
2011/04/22
2011/04/23
2011/04/24
2011/04/25
2011/04/26
2011/04/27
2011/04/28
2011/04/29
2011/04/30
Browse by creation date
Browse by origin
Embassy Athens
Embassy Asuncion
Embassy Astana
Embassy Asmara
Embassy Ashgabat
Embassy Apia
Embassy Ankara
Embassy Amman
Embassy Algiers
Embassy Addis Ababa
Embassy Accra
Embassy Abuja
Embassy Abu Dhabi
Embassy Abidjan
Consulate Auckland
Consulate Amsterdam
Consulate Adana
American Institute Taiwan, Taipei
Embassy Bujumbura
Embassy Buenos Aires
Embassy Budapest
Embassy Bucharest
Embassy Brussels
Embassy Bridgetown
Embassy Bratislava
Embassy Brasilia
Embassy Bogota
Embassy Bishkek
Embassy Bern
Embassy Berlin
Embassy Belmopan
Embassy Belgrade
Embassy Beirut
Embassy Beijing
Embassy Banjul
Embassy Bangkok
Embassy Bandar Seri Begawan
Embassy Bamako
Embassy Baku
Embassy Baghdad
Consulate Barcelona
Embassy Copenhagen
Embassy Conakry
Embassy Colombo
Embassy Chisinau
Embassy Caracas
Embassy Canberra
Embassy Cairo
Consulate Curacao
Consulate Ciudad Juarez
Consulate Chennai
Consulate Casablanca
Consulate Cape Town
Consulate Calgary
Embassy Dushanbe
Embassy Dublin
Embassy Doha
Embassy Djibouti
Embassy Dili
Embassy Dhaka
Embassy Dar Es Salaam
Embassy Damascus
Embassy Dakar
Consulate Dubai
Embassy Helsinki
Embassy Harare
Embassy Hanoi
Consulate Ho Chi Minh City
Consulate Hermosillo
Consulate Hamilton
Consulate Hamburg
Consulate Halifax
Embassy Kyiv
Embassy Kuwait
Embassy Kuala Lumpur
Embassy Kinshasa
Embassy Kingston
Embassy Kigali
Embassy Khartoum
Embassy Kathmandu
Embassy Kampala
Embassy Kabul
Consulate Kolkata
Embassy Luxembourg
Embassy Luanda
Embassy London
Embassy Ljubljana
Embassy Lisbon
Embassy Lima
Embassy Lilongwe
Embassy La Paz
Consulate Lahore
Consulate Lagos
Mission USOSCE
Mission USNATO
Mission UNESCO
Embassy Muscat
Embassy Moscow
Embassy Montevideo
Embassy Monrovia
Embassy Minsk
Embassy Mexico
Embassy Mbabane
Embassy Maputo
Embassy Manila
Embassy Manama
Embassy Managua
Embassy Malabo
Embassy Madrid
Consulate Munich
Consulate Mumbai
Consulate Montreal
Consulate Monterrey
Consulate Milan
Consulate Melbourne
Embassy Nicosia
Embassy Niamey
Embassy New Delhi
Embassy Ndjamena
Embassy Nassau
Embassy Nairobi
Consulate Naples
Consulate Naha
Embassy Pristina
Embassy Pretoria
Embassy Prague
Embassy Port Of Spain
Embassy Port Louis
Embassy Port Au Prince
Embassy Phnom Penh
Embassy Paris
Embassy Paramaribo
Embassy Panama
Consulate Peshawar
REO Basrah
Embassy Rome
Embassy Riyadh
Embassy Riga
Embassy Reykjavik
Embassy Rangoon
Embassy Rabat
Consulate Rio De Janeiro
Consulate Recife
Secretary of State
Embassy Suva
Embassy Stockholm
Embassy Sofia
Embassy Skopje
Embassy Singapore
Embassy Seoul
Embassy Sarajevo
Embassy Santo Domingo
Embassy Santiago
Embassy Sanaa
Embassy San Salvador
Embassy San Jose
Consulate Strasbourg
Consulate St Petersburg
Consulate Shenyang
Consulate Shanghai
Consulate Sapporo
Consulate Sao Paulo
Embassy Tunis
Embassy Tripoli
Embassy Tokyo
Embassy The Hague
Embassy Tel Aviv
Embassy Tehran
Embassy Tegucigalpa
Embassy Tbilisi
Embassy Tashkent
Embassy Tallinn
Consulate Toronto
Consulate Tijuana
USUN New York
USEU Brussels
US Office Almaty
US Mission Geneva
US Interests Section Havana
US Delegation, Secretary
UNVIE
Embassy Ulaanbaatar
Embassy Vilnius
Embassy Vienna
Embassy Vatican
Embassy Valletta
Consulate Vladivostok
Consulate Vancouver
Browse by tag
AU
ASEC
AE
AF
AORC
AEMR
AMGT
ABUD
AFFAIRS
APER
AS
AMED
AY
AG
AR
AJ
AL
AID
AM
AODE
ABLD
AMG
AFIN
ATRN
AGAO
AFU
AN
AA
ALOW
APECO
ADM
ARF
ASEAN
APEC
AMBASSADOR
AO
ASUP
AZ
AADP
ACOA
ANET
AMCHAMS
ACABQ
ASECKFRDCVISKIRFPHUMSMIGEG
APCS
AGMT
AINF
AIT
AORL
ACS
AFSI
AFSN
ACBAQ
AFGHANISTAN
ADANA
ADPM
AX
ADCO
AECL
AMEX
ACAO
ASCH
AORG
AGR
AROC
ASIG
AND
ARM
AQ
ATFN
AC
AUC
ASEX
AER
AVERY
AGRICULTURE
BL
BR
BO
BA
BD
BM
BK
BG
BU
BB
BH
BTIO
BY
BEXP
BP
BE
BRUSSELS
BF
BIDEN
BT
BX
BC
BILAT
BN
BBSR
BTIU
BWC
BMGT
CA
CASC
CVIS
CM
CH
CO
CU
CD
CWC
CI
CS
CY
CMGT
CF
CG
CR
CB
CV
CW
CE
CBW
CT
CPAS
COUNTERTERRORISM
CJAN
CODEL
CIDA
CDG
CDC
CIA
CTR
CNARC
CSW
CN
CONS
CLINTON
COE
CROS
CARICOM
CONDOLEEZZA
COUNTER
CL
COM
CICTE
CIS
CFED
COUNTRY
CJUS
CBSA
CEUDA
CLMT
CAC
COPUOS
CIC
CBE
CHR
CTM
CVR
CITEL
CLEARANCE
CACS
CAN
CITT
CARSON
CACM
CDB
CAPC
CKGR
CBC
EC
EG
EPET
ECON
ETRD
EFIN
EIND
EMIN
ENRG
EAID
EAGR
EUN
ETTC
EAIR
ENIV
ES
EU
EINV
ELAB
ECIN
EFIS
ELTN
EWWT
ECPS
ECONOMIC
ENGR
EN
EINT
EPA
ELN
ESA
EZ
ER
ET
EFTA
EINVECONSENVCSJA
EUMEM
ETRA
EXTERNAL
EI
EUR
EK
ERNG
ENGY
ETRDEINVECINPGOVCS
ENERG
EINVEFIN
ENVR
ECA
ELECTIONS
ETC
EUREM
ENNP
EFINECONCS
EURN
ECINECONCS
EEPET
EXIM
ERD
ENVI
ETRC
ETRDEINVTINTCS
ETRO
EDU
ETRN
EAIG
ECONCS
ECONOMICS
EAP
ECONOMY
EINN
EIAR
EXBS
ECUN
EINDETRD
EREL
EUC
ESENV
ECONEFIN
ECIP
EFIM
EAIDS
ETRDECONWTOCS
EUNCH
EINVETC
IZ
IT
IR
IS
IN
IC
IAEA
IO
ICAO
IWC
ID
IV
ISRAEL
IAHRC
IQ
ICTR
IMF
IRS
IDP
IGAD
ICRC
ICTY
IMO
IL
INRA
INRO
ICJ
ITU
IBRD
INMARSAT
IIP
ITALY
IEFIN
IACI
ILO
INTELSAT
ILC
ITRA
IDA
INRB
IRC
INTERPOL
IA
IPR
IRAQI
ISRAELI
INTERNAL
ISLAMISTS
INDO
ITPHUM
ITPGOV
ITALIAN
IBET
INR
IEA
IZPREL
IRAJ
ITF
IF
KDEM
KU
KPAL
KNNP
KCRM
KZ
KN
KS
KJUS
KTFN
KSCA
KV
KISL
KPAO
KPKO
KIRF
KTIA
KIPR
KFLO
KFRD
KTIP
KAWC
KSUM
KCOM
KAID
KE
KTDB
KMDR
KOMC
KWBG
KDRG
KVPR
KTEX
KGIC
KWMN
KSCI
KCOR
KACT
KDDG
KHLS
KSAF
KFLU
KSEO
KMRS
KSPR
KOLY
KSEP
KVIR
KGHG
KIRC
KUNR
KIFR
KCIP
KMCA
KMPI
KBCT
KHSA
KICC
KIDE
KCRS
KMFO
KRVC
KRGY
KR
KAWK
KG
KFIN
KHIV
KBIO
KOCI
KBTR
KNEI
KPOA
KCFE
KPLS
KSTC
KHDP
KPRP
KCRCM
KLIG
KCFC
KTER
KREC
KTBT
KPRV
KSTH
KRIM
KRAD
KWAC
KWMM
KFRDCVISCMGTCASCKOCIASECPHUMSMIGEG
KOMS
KX
KMIG
KRCM
KVRP
KBTS
KPAONZ
KNUC
KNAR
KPWR
KNPP
KDEMAF
KNUP
KNNPMNUC
KERG
KGIT
KPAI
KTLA
KFSC
KCSY
KSAC
KTRD
KID
KOM
KMOC
KJUST
KGCC
KREL
KFRDKIRFCVISCMGTKOCIASECPHUMSMIGEG
KFTFN
KO
KNSD
KHUM
KSEC
KCMR
KCHG
KICA
KPIN
KESS
KDEV
KCGC
KWWMN
KPAK
KWNM
KWMNCS
KRFD
MOPS
MCAP
MPOS
MARR
MO
MNUC
MX
MASS
MG
MY
MU
ML
MR
MILITARY
MTCRE
MT
MEPP
MA
MDC
MP
MAR
MASSMNUC
MARAD
MAPP
MZ
MD
MI
MEETINGS
MK
MCC
MEPN
MRCRE
MAS
MIL
MASC
MC
MV
MTCR
MIK
MUCN
MEDIA
MERCOSUR
MW
MOPPS
MTS
MLS
MILI
MTRE
MEPI
MQADHAFI
MAPS
NO
NATO
NL
NP
NZ
NSF
NI
NH
NG
NAFTA
NU
NASA
NR
NATOPREL
NSSP
NSG
NA
NT
NW
NK
NPT
NPA
NATIONAL
NPG
NSFO
NS
NSC
NE
NGO
NDP
NIPP
NRR
NEW
NZUS
NC
NAR
NV
NORAD
OTRA
OPCW
OVIP
OAS
OREP
OPIC
OIIP
OPRC
ODIP
OEXC
OPDC
OSCE
OIC
OSCI
OECD
OFDP
OFDA
OMIG
OPAD
OFFICIALS
OVP
OIE
OHUM
OCS
OBSP
OTR
OSAC
ON
OCII
OES
PGOV
PREL
PHUM
PTER
PINS
PINR
PREF
PK
PROP
PA
PARM
PBTS
PMAR
PM
PGIV
PE
PRAM
PHUH
PHSA
PL
PNAT
PO
PLN
PAO
PSA
PHUMPGOV
PF
PEL
PBIO
POLITICS
PHUMBA
PAS
POL
PREO
PAHO
PMIL
POGOV
POV
PAK
PNR
PRL
PG
PREFA
PSI
PINL
PU
PARMS
PRGOV
PALESTINIAN
PAIGH
POLITICAL
PARTIES
POSTS
PROG
PORG
PTBS
PUNE
POLICY
PDOV
PCI
PGOVSMIGKCRMKWMNPHUMCVISKFRDCA
PBT
PP
PS
PY
PTERE
PGOF
PKFK
PSOE
PEPR
PPA
PINT
PRELP
PSEPC
PGOVE
PINF
PNG
PGOC
PFOR
PCUL
POLINT
PGGV
PHALANAGE
PARTY
PGOVLO
PHUS
PDEM
PECON
PROV
PHUMPREL
RS
RU
RELATIONS
RW
RO
RM
RP
ROOD
RICE
RUPREL
RSO
RCMP
REACTION
REPORT
REGION
RIGHTS
RF
RFE
RSP
RIGHTSPOLMIL
ROBERT
SU
SCUL
SNAR
SOCI
SF
SA
SHUM
SENV
SP
SR
SY
SANC
SC
SMIG
SZ
SARS
SW
SEVN
SO
SEN
SL
SNARCS
SNARN
SI
SG
SN
SH
SYR
SAARC
SPCE
SHI
SCRS
SENVKGHG
SYRIA
SWE
STEINBERG
SIPRS
ST
SNARIZ
SSA
SK
SPCVIS
SOFA
SIPDIS
SAN
TC
TI
TBIO
TH
TSPL
TRGY
TSPA
TPHY
TU
TW
TS
TAGS
TK
TX
TNGD
TZ
TF
TL
TV
TN
TD
TIP
TR
TP
TO
TT
TFIN
THPY
TERRORISM
TINT
TRSY
TURKEY
TBID
US
UK
UNGA
UP
UZ
UNMIK
USTR
UNO
UNSC
UN
UNESCO
UNAUS
UNHRC
UY
UG
UNHCR
UNCND
USOAS
USEU
UNICEF
UNEP
UV
UNPUOS
UNCSD
USUN
UNCHR
UNDC
USNC
UE
UNDP
UNC
USPS
USAID
UNVIE
UAE
UNFICYP
UNODC
UNCHS
UNIDROIT
UNDESCO
UNCHC
Browse by classification
Community resources
courage is contagious
Viewing cable 09CAIRO1857, ENGAGING AYMAN NOUR
If you are new to these pages, please read an introduction on the structure of a cable as well as how to discuss them with others. See also the FAQs
Understanding cables
Every cable message consists of three parts:
- The top box shows each cables unique reference number, when and by whom it originally was sent, and what its initial classification was.
- The middle box contains the header information that is associated with the cable. It includes information about the receiver(s) as well as a general subject.
- The bottom box presents the body of the cable. The opening can contain a more specific subject, references to other cables (browse by origin to find them) or additional comment. This is followed by the main contents of the cable: a summary, a collection of specific topics and a comment section.
Discussing cables
If you find meaningful or important information in a cable, please link directly to its unique reference number. Linking to a specific paragraph in the body of a cable is also possible by copying the appropriate link (to be found at theparagraph symbol). Please mark messages for social networking services like Twitter with the hash tags #cablegate and a hash containing the reference ID e.g. #09CAIRO1857.
Reference ID | Created | Released | Classification | Origin |
---|---|---|---|---|
09CAIRO1857 | 2009-09-27 14:45 | 2011-02-16 21:00 | CONFIDENTIAL | Embassy Cairo |
VZCZCXYZ0001
OO RUEHWEB
DE RUEHEG #1857/01 2701445
ZNY CCCCC ZZH
O 271445Z SEP 09
FM AMEMBASSY CAIRO
TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC IMMEDIATE 3711
INFO RHEHNSC/NSC WASHDC IMMEDIATE
C O N F I D E N T I A L CAIRO 001857
SIPDIS
FOR NEA/ELA AND DRL/NESCA
NSC FOR KUMAR
E.O. 12958: DECL: 09/24/2019
TAGS: PREL PGOV KDEM PHUM EG
SUBJECT: ENGAGING AYMAN NOUR
REF: CAIRO 00393
Classified By: Ambassador Margaret Scobey for reasons 1.4 (b) and (d)
1.(C) Key Points: -- The Ambassador met with Ayman Nour on September 24 for the first time following his February 2009 release from prison. During the meeting Nour acknowledged the importance of U.S. support during his detention. -- Nour indicated he wished to travel to the U.S. in November, noting coordination with U.S. NGOs including Freedom House on his schedule. Nour's visa application is under review. -- While not ruling out his own candidacy for president in 2011, Nour did not expect restrictions on his participation would be removed and added that he was focused on rebuilding his party. -- Nour said he is focusing his sights on the 2017 elections rather than 2011 in part because time would be needed to "rebuild" his party. -- Nour noted the desire for change among average Egyptians was strong and warned of three "dangers": the appeal of the Islamist alternative in the absence of a "civilian" presidential candidate; possible unrest following Gamal Mubarak's succession that could lead to a military coup or increased Islamist influence; lack of U.S. "interference" in the elections would be seen as lack of interest in the welfare of Egyptians.
2.(C) Comment: Despite earlier concerns about meeting with U.S. officials, Nour appeared eager to engage with the Ambassador on his political future, his expectations for upcoming elections and the role that the U.S. can play in promoting democracy in Egypt. While Nour made some comments about government interference in his April trip to Europe and his warm welcome at a soccer match in Mahallah in which he claimed those present began shouting his name followed by "Down with Mubarak!," Nour's comments were thoughtful and free of the hyperbole he has become known for. Since his release, Nour has continued to pursue a high profile political role for himself but has been criticized in the media for his efforts to regain the limelight. Privately, several former Nour confidantes, including XXXXXXXXXXXX have commented that his public statements have damaged him and have been frustrated that their advice to Nour to keep a lower profile has been ignored. This additional dose of reality may be the reason Nour has decided to focus his personal aspirations on 2017. Nour's dire predictions about a strong public reaction to Gamal or the possibility of a military coup are views not widely held by other Embassy contacts. End Comment.
3.(C) On September 24, opposition leader and former president of the Al-Ghad party Ayman Nour sat down with the Ambassador for the first time following his release on February 19, 2009. In his initial meeting with PolOff two weeks after his release (reftel) Nour suggested that he wanted to "put some distance" between himself and the U.S. While Embassy Cairo has kept in regular contact with leadership of the Nour wing of the Al-Ghad party, Nour has only recently indicated that he is receptive to meetings with U.S. representatives. Nour thanked the Ambassador for her statements before Congress and acknowledged the importance of U.S. support during his detention. Nour credited his early release to external pressure from "supporters of freedom" and the change in the U.S. administration. Nour noted that despite government limitations, he remained politically active, leading a "door-knock" mission to more than 20 governorates in which he met with the people to discuss their concerns and Al Ghad's platform. Nour said he was barred from running for office for five years. He called the restriction politically motivated and not legally required, and said he has initiated a legal case to over-turn limits placed on him. ----------------------- Nour Travel to the U.S. -----------------------
4.(C) Nour raised with the Ambassador his intention to travel to the U.S. for about 10 days in mid-November, but said that he did not yet have a specific schedule. (Note: Nour submitted a visa request and was interviewed by the Consul General on September 24 following his meeting with the Ambassador. Processing is underway, but visa issuance requires a waiver due to Nour's conviction. Following his conviction he must also apply for an exit permit from the GoE before travelling. End Note) Nour first relayed his desire to travel to the U.S. at an August 29 meeting with members of a StaffDel from the House Foreign Relations Committee, Tom Lantos Commission on Human Rights. We understand that he intends to travel with members of the April 6th movement, specifically Ahmed Salah.
5.(C) Nour told the Ambassador that while in the U.S. he would be participating in a conference on human rights in the Middle East in mid-November that would include other participants from Iran and Kuwait, but was unable to name the U.S. NGO that was the conference sponsor. Nour also said Freedom House would be arranging at least some of his meetings in Washington. Nour expects to remain in the U.S. for ten days after a short trip to Europe and will meet with government officials, members of Congress, think tank and NGO representatives as well as Egyptians living in the U.S. to discuss human rights in Egypt. His current plans also include a trip to Canada to attend the executive committee meeting of Liberal International (LI), at which the international federation of liberal parties would officially accept the Al Ghad party's application for membership. Nour added that LI will hold its annual congress in Alexandria, Egypt on October 29. (Note: The event is being sponsored by Osama Al Ghazali Harb's Democratic Front Party, already an LI member. End Note.) ----------------- Nour on Elections -----------------
6.(C) When asked for his views on the upcoming 2010 parliamentary and 2011 presidential elections, Nour said that his focus was not on this but the next election cycle. Nour added that not only were the restrictions on his own candidacy a reason for that shift in focus, but that his party needed four to five years to get back on its feet. He suggested that the coming elections would only rearrange power within the regime and were not likely to be an opportunity for real democratic opening. Nour later told PolOff that if he was allowed to be a candidate in 2011 he would run. He added that he expected that in a "fifty-percent fair" election against Gamal, he would win handily, but said that because of President Mubarak's popularity with the military and security services he would have only marginal success if running against Mubarak Sr.
7.(C) Nour suggested that the limited likelihood of real change in the 2011 elections coupled with the desire for democratic transition from the Egyptian "street" would lead to three principal "dangers" for Egypt that were of mutual concern. The first is the impact of the lack of a real "civilian" or secular alternative to the current regime. While Nour saw himself filling this role, he suggested the regime's continued lack of openness to participation by secular opposition created a vacuum that might only be filled by the Muslim Brotherhood (MB). Second, Gamal Mubarak's succession would likely bring with it unrest because, according to Nour, Gamal lacks any real popular support. Nour suggested that rejection of Gamal by the public could usher in either a military coup or increased Islamist influence. Third, lack of international pressure on democratic progress would be read as lack of interest and lead to some kind of public resentment and questioning of U.S. motives. Nour underlined that the environment is not the same as it was in 2005 where average citizens (as well as the opposition) rejected the idea of international monitoring or U.S. "interference" in internal Egyptian affairs. International monitors were now being demanded. --------------------------------------- Nour on NDP Reformers and MB Popularity ---------------------------------------
8.(C) When asked about reformers within the ruling National Democratic Party (NDP), Nour acknowledged figures like Shura Council member Hossam Badrawi and said he did not doubt their reformist agenda or liberal credentials, but called them powerless to implement those reforms. Fundamentally, Nour said Egypt remains a police state and policy is more likely to be implemented by the local police than liberal members of the ruling party. According to Nour, the old guard remains in power and although the presence of reformists in the NDP was a cause for optimism, the regime remains a closed system. When pressed on the real extent of the influence and power wielded by the MB, Nour suggested that many voters in MB strongholds were not true supporters of MB ideals. Votes for the MB in 2005 had to a large extent been a protest against the regime. Nour added that his party was having some success in attracting MB supporters who were more "moderate." Scobey